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INSIDER: MIKE ACTON

How much does framerate matter?

Posted on Oct 29, 2009
Recently we've been asking ourselves some hard questions:
What is it that we want to focus on?
What's most important to us?
What do we want to make?
 
And the answer is simple:
 
We want to give you guys, our fans and players, the best looking games you can buy on a console.
 
You may have already seen Ratchet and Clank Future: A Crack in Time (available in US stores now!)
 
 
I'm really proud of what our art and production teams accomplished in this game. It's a great looking game, a ton of fun to play and is 60fps.
 
And it's that last point that I want to talk about today. One of the long-standing sacred cows here at Insomniac is framerate. We’ve long viewed a solid framerate as both a sign of a quality product and professionalism as developers. It’s always been point of pride in our work and considered an extremely serious part of our development process.
 
However, during development, there are hard choices to be made between higher quality graphics and framerate. And we want to make the right choices that reflect our commitment to providing you with the best looking games out there. To that end, our community team did some research into the question of framerate. The results perhaps confirmed what I’ve known for a long time, but found it difficult to accept without evidence. They found that:
 
A higher framerate does not significantly affect sales of a game.
A higher framerate does not significantly affect the reviews of a game.
 
And in particular they found that there was a clear correlation between graphics scores in reviews (where they are provided) and the final scores. And they found no such correlation between framerate and the graphics scores nor the final scores. As an interesting side-note, our team also found no direct correlation between gameplay scores and final scores, however it does appear that gameplay scores are also influenced by graphics scores. i.e. Better looking games appear to be more “fun” to reviewers, in general.
 
 
 
After reviewing our internal research, I decided to take this question to the public. I wanted to see what the players themselves thought of this question. Here are the results of that poll
 
 
The first thing I noted in reviewing these results was that 16% of the respondents said they wouldn’t buy a non 60fps game. Now, considering the top selling games and the market research, I take that to mean one of two things:
 
People are big fat liars. Sales numbers clearly contradict this pattern. Or,
The group responding to this poll in the first place was a self-selected group of people with an interest in framerate in the first place. Which may also explain why that last group is represented by such a small response rate in the poll results.
 
Based on the research, the informal polling and various conversations with fans and other game buyers, I’ve come to the following conclusions: 
 
Framerate is important, but not critically so. When there is a clear choice between framerate and improved graphics, graphics should win. The correlation with review scores is clear.
 
There is virtually no advantage in sales or reviews of a 60 fps game versus a 30 fps game.
 
Only a minority of players notice framerate as a significant issue of any kind.
 
Framerate should be as consistent as possible and should never interfere with the game. However, a drop in framerate is interestingly seen by some players as a reward for creating or forcing a complex setup in which a lot of things must happen on the screen at once. As in, “Damn! Did you see that? That was crazy!”
 
A solid framerate is still a sign of professional, well-made product. When there is a trade-off for framerate, it needs to be clearly worth it. i.e. It must introduce clear improvements on what the player sees, and never used as an excuse to not optimize the game or art.
 
 
What does all of this mean, really?
  
It means that framerate is still important to us here at Insomniac, but it’s not on the same pedestal it was before. And that Ratchet and Clank Future: A Crack in Time will probably be Insomniac’s last 60fps game.
 
 
Mike.
 
PS (Update 30 October 2009)
 
 
dixee wrote:
Plus, there are other advantages. You can load things twice as fast (assuming it's being streamed during gameplay) and calculate twice as many collisions. Frame rate involves more than just drawing methods, unless I'm drastically mistaken. Am I?
 
You really can't load things any faster regardless of your framerate. The speed (seek and throughput rate) of loading is limited by device you're loading from (e.g. the Bluray). But yes, a lower framerate does give you "extra" time to do other operations as well, outside of rendering. Collision, as you mentioned, is an example.
 
Rhez Darkhoof wrote:
Framerate is nice but gameplay and graphics probably have more effect on the overall experience. I mean how high can we really get the framerate before the human eye can't distinguish the difference.?
 
The human eye and brain are seriously sophisticated equipment. It's certainly possible to distinguish very high framerates. Much higher, in fact, than 60fps. But the question is more about how important is it to most players (and reviewers) when when offered the choice against "better graphics" of some kind. We want to give players better graphics, because ultimately that's what so many are asking for.
 
Arelius wrote:
Mike, I'd like to make a few strong counter points. First of all, regarding your Poll, and the fact that 16% said they wouldn't buy a non 60 FPS game. Keep in mind there were no other "I prefer a 60 FPS game" option, so while the exact text may have said "60 FPS or I won't buy" it got people saying "I prefer 60 FPS and it influences my purchases."
 
So, yeah. I should have clarified the point. That poll was extremely informal and didn't play a significant part in the decision process. It was more a point of interest. However, we can see through sales data what people are saying when they speak with their hard-earned money. And we simply don't see any significant correlation between framerate and what people want to buy.
 
But I don't want to dismiss the importance of framerate, either. As I said, it is still important to us. We certainly understand how framerate can affect the game experience. And we definitely have people here that prefer 60fps as well. But when it comes right down to it, when we have to make a choice, that choice has to be made based on what we think you guys will like better. And what you'd actually prefer to buy, in general. It's not a perfect system.
 
 
mgibson wrote:
That graph of overall scores and graphics scores makes no sense. The horizontal axis is meaningless.
 
Just to be clear, what I wrote was definitely not about the details of our research. There is clearly a lot of information that I didn't present. Nor did I present it in a way that could allow for any kind of rigorous analysis. I'm more speaking about what conclusions we've drawn and why we think it's interesting. 
 
The horizontal axis represents the individual games. The vertices are the only things that have any meaning. The lines drawn between them are not meaningful data themselves, but do help visualize the pattern for an informal view.
 
MiZa wrote:
I know, my words are wasted though as soon as I read your mission statement. If it reads "We want to give you guys, our fans and players, the best looking games you can buy on a console" instead of "We want to give you guys, our fans and players, the best games you can buy on a console" then there is no hope.

That's a good point, MiZa. And we do want to provide you the best games you can buy on a console. Though here, I'm speaking specifically about engine (and art) choices, and ultimately this question is fairly narrowly focused on the A/V experience.
 
superdynamite wrote:
Let me start off by saying that frame rate plays a tremendous part in the gameplay of a "Next-Gen" videogame. The statement that was made by Insomniac, sighting "no correlation between 60 fps benchmark to yield higher retail sales" is complete and utter nonsense,
 
I appreciate your view here, superdynamite. But I'm going to stick by our research. Certainly you can look at many current games that run at 30 fps and ask if their sales have been impacted by not being 60 fps. Additionally, I'd be surprised if you could find a single review (in similar genres of games that we work on) that penalized a game for not being 60 fps.
 
Thanks so much for all of your heartfelt feedback everyone! And keep in mind that I'm certainly not saying 60 fps has no value or that framerate isn't important. It's simply about focusing on what we think is most important and devoting resources to that. So that when you pick up our games, you know you're going to get an awesome graphical experience. Along with great fun.
 
 
 
 
 
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Toppot
Toppot Oct 30, 2009, 7:01 am
Good post. I agree that 60 fps isn't necessary, to me Resistance has always looked a bit behind other First Person Shooters at 30fps. If you guys can keep a solid 30 fps and improve the graphics then it's win win. Will be interesting to see what you have in a years time.

For the time being I'm still waiting for ACIT to be released in UK, I want my Collectors Edition.
dixee
dixee Oct 30, 2009, 7:02 am
Yes! I was just thinking about this the other day. 60 is nice, but is it really necessary? How much better could graphics be if it were dropped back down to 30? Plus, there are other advantages. You can load things twice as fast (assuming it's being streamed during gameplay) and calculate twice as many collisions. Frame rate involves more than just drawing methods, unless I'm drastically mistaken. Am I?
Devils Dog
Devils Dog Oct 30, 2009, 7:23 am
I don't think my TV plays at 60 FPS anyway so I don't care.

Whichever looks better is the better choice, I'd rather have a 30fps game with slightly better graphics than a 60fps game with good graphics.
RedHawk
RedHawk Oct 30, 2009, 7:32 am
Nice thing about PC is you can do both. I'm fine with 30 FPS on console but 60 really is silky smooth it makes everything look very nice.
Ratchet_Co
Ratchet_Co Oct 30, 2009, 7:40 am
Nice read, personally I take the fps of a game a bit seriously. But Graphics and gameplay are a lot more important than fps.
Catharz
Catharz Oct 30, 2009, 7:52 am
I prefer a game to be 60FPS (especially racing games like GT5), but Uncharted 2 proved definitively that you don't need 60FPS to have an awesome gaming experience. Where we'll need 60fps is when/if shutter glasses based 3D gaming takes off. Anything less than 60FPS will cause headaches.

Anyway, from what I've seen it doesn't look like the quest for 60FPS has hurt the graphics in the R&C future series at all.
I do wish it was a world-wide release though. Another week to go til I can pick up my pre-order. /sigh
Pyrocitor
Pyrocitor Oct 30, 2009, 7:54 am
Interesting read, personally I don't have a problem with 30fps on consoles, providing it doesn't drop below that, if it does I usually notice it. I think it is more noticeable on PC's though and I will quite often drop some extra AA for more FPS.

I have to agree with the point about finding it rewarding to make the FPS drop due to making an excessive amount of stuff happen on screen. However it is more impressive when you do something crazy and intense and the game handles it without a hitch.
agent069
agent069 Oct 30, 2009, 8:02 am
60 FPS isn't mandatory, but games looks better at 60fps, and their more responsive. I can understand that from a developer's point of view, it may not be worth the effort.

Also think about Modern Warfare, it may not be the best looking FPS out there, but it's the one that feels better, and the framerate plays a big factor. Personally I prefer less impressive visual with silky smooth framerate and great image quality. But yeah, that won't help reviews and sell...

But you know Insomniac, I love you because you make great games, great games don't always great reviews or great sales. I think you'd better design games as you think they should be done, too much focus testing or listening to the reviews or the community will just result in games with less personally. And you will definitely lose your core fanbase if you take this way. Just look at Resistance 2, why do most RFOM fans hate it? Because it took a lot of what made the original such a unique game.... I'm not saying that you must not listen to the outside world, but don't overdo it. Consumers don't always know what they really want.
Devil May Cry
Devil May Cry Oct 30, 2009, 8:05 am
Left a comment on Facebook, but I'll re-iterate. As long as the effort from the framerate drop from 60 to 30 is put into other areas, i doubt there'd be an problem at all. You guys aren't ones to give us a shoddy product, so I doubt that'd ever be an issue.
agent069
agent069 Oct 30, 2009, 8:11 am
60 FPS isn't mandatory, but games looks better at 60fps, and their more responsive. I can understand that from a developer's point of view, it may not be worth the effort.

Also think about Modern Warfare, it may not be the best looking FPS out there, but it's the one that feels better, and the framerate plays a big factor. Personally I prefer less impressive visual with silky smooth framerate and great image quality. But yeah, that won't help reviews and sell...

But you know Insomniac, I love you because you make great games, great games don't always great reviews or great sales. I think you'd better design games as you think they should be done, too much focus testing or listening to the reviews or the community will just result in games with less personally. And you will definitely lose your core fanbase if you take this way. Just look at Resistance 2, why do most RFOM fans hate it? Because it took a lot of what made the original such a unique game.... I'm not saying that you must not listen to the outside world, but don't overdo it. Consumers don't always know what they really want.
agent069
agent069 Oct 30, 2009, 8:11 am
60 FPS isn't mandatory, but games looks better at 60fps, and their more responsive. I can understand that from a developer's point of view, it may not be worth the effort.

Also think about Modern Warfare, it may not be the best looking FPS out there, but it's the one that feels better, and the framerate plays a big factor. Personally I prefer less impressive visual with silky smooth framerate and great image quality. But yeah, that won't help reviews and sell...

But you know Insomniac, I love you because you make great games, great games don't always great reviews or great sales. I think you'd better design games as you think they should be done, too much focus testing or listening to the reviews or the community will just result in games with less personally. And you will definitely lose your core fanbase if you take this way. Just look at Resistance 2, why do most RFOM fans hate it? Because it took a lot of what made the original such a unique game.... I'm not saying that you must not listen to the outside world, but don't overdo it. Consumers don't always know what they really want.
agent069
agent069 Oct 30, 2009, 8:12 am
Sorry, I didn't mean to spam the site, is there a way to suppress my triple post? XD
Devils Dog
Devils Dog Oct 30, 2009, 8:26 am
If you didn't post the last bit it would have only been a double post.
CymbalRush
CymbalRush Oct 30, 2009, 1:55 pm
I'm trying to remember what I selected in the poll... it was a toss-up for me between "whatever as long as it's rock solid" and "whatever as long as it doesn't interfere with the game." I saw the two as being very similar, if not equal. A fluctuating framerate *does* interfere with the game in my opinion, but to what degree is certainly debatable. I also agree that stuttering the framerate can almost be seen as an accomplishment, but that's only with games where you know work was put into the framerate to begin with. If I manage to drop the framerate in a game like Burnout or Call of Duty 4 where framerate was a large consideration, I *know* I'm pulling some crap off that the developers didn't anticipate. If I drop it in The Orange Box, I simply get upset with whatever team was responsible for porting it to PS3. Framerate drops *definitely* have to be justified, where the chaos going on on-screen is too much for a person to react to anyways, it can't just be when you turn every other corner or something (obviously).

I certainly don't mind 30 fps games, myself, but there definitely has to be evidence of that trade-off, so if you're going to sacrifice that sacred cow, I'm sure you guys will find great uses for the parts (sorry that's pretty gross, I can see why you stopped your analogy there, Mike =P)

- Matthew
Rhez Darkhoof
Rhez Darkhoof Oct 30, 2009, 2:08 pm
Framerate is nice but gameplay and graphics probably have more effect on the overall experience. I mean how high can we really get the framerate before the human eye can't distinguish the difference.? As long as it doesn't look like a bad slideshow I'm good. Standard def for movie theatres is what 24fps? 30fps is pretty standard for television screens. The tradeoff seems pretty clear. Increasing the framerate is a lot of effort for only a small payoff. Economically that time would be better spent on graphics.

Yes I was disappointed with R2. It looked great but it felt too generic. I really liked R:FOM because of the R&C style inventory. Lots of weapons on hand at any moment. Probably one of the same reasons I enjoyed Bioshock's gameplay so much. R2 really lost something. It proved what Insomniac could do with a standard FPS but that's just what it was. The only other complaint with R2 was losing Nathan Hale. Grr...any way to resurrect him for R3? Oh well.
S-r-e-x
S-r-e-x Oct 30, 2009, 2:53 pm
I too find 60fps as overkill, and it would be fun to see what you guys could squeeze out with half the framerate, and maybe do as SE did between FFX and FFXII; trade poly's (where you can?) for textures and lighting, if you haven't done that already.

OK, 60fps=cool, but nothing more. R:FoM played with 45fps, didn't it? At least recall it wasn't a full 60, but it felt good enough for me. I actually think that high framerates are a thing brought over from PC's, where high-end hardware gives you a higher framerate, which in turn makes you "cool". Thus 60fps (which is high) on console must also be "cool", just in a different way since the hardware is locked and you must rely on the engine instead.
Dageram
Dageram Oct 30, 2009, 3:08 pm
"However, a drop in framerate is interestingly seen by some players as a reward for creating or forcing a complex setup in which a lot of things must happen on the screen at once"

ok...
kingkibble
kingkibble Oct 30, 2009, 3:47 pm
Hey, I'd just like to say that, though I am probably in the minority, a 60 fps game really does make a difference to me. Personally, I'd rather have a game that runs at 60 fps, even if it means unlocking the framerate and allowing some slowdown. Most people can't even see the difference, but sometimes a game running at lower than 60 fps can really be a deal breaker for me.

Ratchet and Clank was one of the few remaining series to understand this, and I'm glad you guys stuck with it for so long. All the same, it's your decision and I respect that, I'm just sad to see it go :\
Ywap
Ywap Oct 30, 2009, 4:34 pm
All this generation has brought us is 30 fps with drops and motion blur. Sometimes it´s even hard to focus on the game itself because of the blur and drops. 60 fps with worse graphics should always prefered rather then 30 fps with blur.



simplex
simplex Oct 30, 2009, 4:35 pm
You're making the right decision.

I didn't even know Insomniac's games were 60fps. I've been judging the graphics in your game as if you were on a level playing field with other developers, and lately that comparison hasn't been as good for you as before. I'd know idea you were going for twice the framerate as these other games.

I can feel your pain over this. I think Insomniac's last two games have been somewhat more overlooked in part, at least, because of competition from visually stunning 30fps games. (Resistance 2 v Killlzone2, Ratchet v Uncharted 2). It's time for you guys to come out from under that 60fps cap and play on a level field with these guys, so to speak. I'm confident you can blow us away as much or more as these other games have.
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